Today Felisha Hunter continues to be the fearless warrior of her recovery and shares the rest of her ongoing journey. Family Recovery is a critical part of Felisha’s story. We dive into codependency and cross-addiction.
Felisha shares an excerpt from her third book entitled ‘I’m a Quitter,’ which will be available June 2023.
To register for The Embrace family Recovery Coaching Group, on March 22nd Sandy Swenson will be our guest! Click this link:
https://sites.google.com/view/efr-coaching-group/home
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See full transcript below.
00:01
You’re listening to the Embrace Family Recovery Podcast. A place for real conversations with people who love someone with the disease of addiction. Now here is your host, Margaret Swift Thompson.
Intro: Welcome back! Today Felisha Hunter continues to be the fearless warrior of her recovery and shares the rest of her ongoing journey. We dive into codependency, cross addiction and Felisha shares an excerpt from her third book entitled ‘I’m a Quitter’ which will be available June 2023. We get a sneak peek!
00:59
The Embrace Family Recovery Podcast
Margaret 01:16
How unbelievably powerful of a story. I mean, I think, holding that for so long. The whole message we hear that secrets keep us sick. And the family stories that aren’t shared because of those secrets.
Felisha: Mm hmm.
Margaret: That would give permission to the next generation to possibly get help sooner.
Felisha 01:41
MmHmm. I toggle with that because one of the questions that I asked them was, did you know? Did you know I was inactive addiction. And they just said we knew you were in pain. And I don’t know if I would have taken help. If it was offered. I don’t know if I would have cared about Papa’s story. Ahead of time.
I think it would have just been put in a closet with my dad’s story. I think it needed to happen when it happened. And I almost think that my family understood that I was going to rebel against anything, and they would rather loves me in that pain, then potentially, like start a war between us. So, they were always kind they never questioned. And I toggle between like, I wish they would have been firm, and been like, Get your shit together. But it all happened the way it was supposed to.
I wouldn’t change a thing. Uh, Do I regret hurting people? Yes, I wish that I would have reached out, I would have been the one to say, I have a problem sooner. Or please stop giving me money. I wish I had the strength to do that when I did, but my addiction took over.
But from me choosing to stop, and onward I wouldn’t change a thing. I’m so grateful for that moment that everything changed.
And recovery is rocky. And not easy at all. It’s the hardest thing I’ve ever done. The hardest thing my family has ever done because I don’t think I realized once I’m entering recovery, they are too. And they are also having to shift.
My mom shared with me; I’ll be three years sober. And my mom shared with me that she still gets anxious when I call. Because there is a chance that when she sees my name, it’s going to be a crisis like it used to be.
Margaret 04:00
I can empathize with your mother. My daughter went through a tremendously painful time, freshman year of college. So she would have been almost 19. I had a revelation two months ago driving with my husband down the highway and I heard her ringtone. And it was the first time I didn’t have my stomach drop, and cold sweats, and nervousness when I heard the ringtone. And that was three years later.
I think we are traumatized by this illness in so many ways and by mental health and addiction and just this hyper alertness. I call it the monkey chatter. So, it’s that voice in my head that is always predicting everything hoping that somehow if I predict everything I can fix, control, manage whatever comes or not be too freaked out by it or terrified by it. None of it works. It’s just like using enough drugs to make everything okay, none of it works. We’ve got to get really clear on working hard at our program. And that’s with program. Always, I’ve been doing that Al-Anon ever since that was the only thing that saved me through that time.
Felisha: Yeah.
Margaret: And I’ve done it before. And I’ve done it since. And I think that being kind to myself and recognizing that I have a trigger response to that call.
Felisha: MmHmm,
Margaret: She can’t fix it for me. She can’t stay stable enough to make it go away. I have to fix how I react to it. And that’s my work.
Felisha 05:40
Yeah, my mom and I have met halfway on it. And now that she’s talked about it, I’m like, what would help? And so now I text her? Do you have time to talk right now. And this is the context I want to catch up. Or I had a really bad day at work. If you have time to call when you’re in a good space, could you call?
So, I give her context of the call. And let her choose when she’s in a good space? And that’s so hard. Because I think I think I thought that I owned my mom. And that my mom is here to serve me. And so, if I call her at 2am, she’s supposed to answer. If I get arrested, she has to bail me out. She’s my mom, that used to be my thinking.
Margaret 06:36
Don’t you think that’s your disease?
Felisha 06:37
Totally. Absolutely.
Margaret 06:41
As a rational human being not under the influence? Is that how you feel?
Felisha: No.
Margaret: So, families listening, that is not quote, normal. I hate the word thinking that is disease thinking that anybody should be at the mercy of this disease along with me when I’m in it.
Felisha 06:57
It’s not just my mom, right? And the disease it was everyone around me needed to be on their knees for me and do what I said when I needed it. And that was that right? And so, coming into recovery. My mom was the last piece of that.
I could do life on life’s terms in every aspect, except my mom, my mom was my lifeline. And she needed to fix every problem. And that was thinking that I had to step away from and realize that this is a partnership. And it’s a relationship that we don’t have to have. It’s not permanent. And so, we need to nurture it, and heal it. And it looks different than other people, because we’ve been through so much. But it’s giving her the grace to heal. It’s meeting each other halfway with whatever makes sense for us. And it has been a long process, but it’s kept my mom in the picture. Me stepping back and dealing with my own stuff and treating her like a partner, like a friend, like somebody I’m in relationship with, versus someone who’s has to serve me because they gave birth to me. Like, that’s terrible thinking right.
Margaret 08:27
I also think in fairness that it’s a mother’s journey to recognize they are not the one to fix the booboo even though as a child that’s exactly what we did and that our own codependency and need to feel like we can make things better. Gets challenged regularly by the disease of addiction and mental health. Because we can’t, and that is one of the hardest things to internalize and learn to then be able to show up differently for our child.
Felisha: Yeah,
Margaret: Our adult child but our child.
Felisha 09:02
Yeah. And I think it even going with that it helps my mom if I can hold my own hand. If I can figure out my own stability, and figure things out for the most part on my own. And now our conversations are just sharing. There’s no dependency for either one of us to fix anything. Usually, it’s just a catch up now. And these are the decisions I’ve been making and whatnot and there’s no fixing needed on either part.
Margaret 09:39
More autonomous than the relationship and able to come together and connection rather than dependence which is beautiful, and that shows your work.
Felisha: Mm hmm.
09:48
This podcast is made possible by listeners like you.
Bumper: I have some amazing news!
On March 22nd at 8:00 PM EST Sandy Swenson the author of many amazing books including my favorite, ‘Tending Dandelions’ will be joining the Embrace Family Recovery Coaching Group and sharing on the topic of ‘We Have Power.’
For 18 years Sandy Swenson has been a powerful voice for parents living in a place where love and addiction meet.
Register to spend time with Sandy and be with others who are on the journey like you.
10:41
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Margaret 10:55
So, sober three years.
Felisha: Mm hmm.
Margaret: Wrote your first book. But you’ve also written a second.
Felisha 11:02
Yes. And I just finished a third. Yeah.
Margaret 11:06
You just finished a third?
Felisha 11:07
Mm hmm. Like, it’ll come out in 2023. But my second is called ‘Internal Bleeding.’
Margaret 11:16
And that is about?
Felisha 11:18
This is about active addiction, and codependency, and recovery from both.
So, what I found was when I got sober, sobriety isn’t recovery. And so, I was sober. I fell in love and rehab and move somebody in that like eight weeks sober, and my addiction went from one thing to the next. It went to men, and then it went from men to food, and then it went to Amazon. And it kept going, and my life was still unmanageable. While I was sober.
Margaret 12:00
My term not unusual term, it’s not mine, unique to me is cross addiction is very real.
Felisha: Yes.
Margaret: And we will put something down. And if we’re not taking care of our well-being in recovery, we will supplement somewhere else. And one of the most challenging ones that happens for people newly sober is new relationships.
Felisha: Yeah.
Margaret: When am I healthy enough to get in one? When is it a partner versus a hostage taking situation or a mood-altering situation? So that’s what your next books about that evolution into recovery?
Felisha 12:36
Yeah, yeah. And then I just finished my third. And it’s called, “I’m a quitter.”
Margaret: Oh!
Felisha: I’m so excited for it. And its lessons of letting go. So, I go through this cross addiction. And for each addiction, there’s a route to it, which required recovery, not just sobriety, it wasn’t enough to just get rid of the boy. Right. It’s more of a memoir. I go through my entire life and link it all together to give lessons.
Margaret 13:14
So, you’re all about putting it on the table, aren’t you? You just put it out there.
Felisha 13:19
Yeah. And I think a lot of that comes from seeing my papa’s relief in talking about it. And so now I am carrying that as well. I’d rather share than pretend that this whole chapter didn’t happen. Because it very much did, and the moment that I forget that it did. I’m in trouble.
Margaret: Aren’t we all?
Felisha: Yeah.
Margaret 13:48
Well, is there a sneak peek of your new book you can share with us before it’s even out? Is that allowed?
Felisha 13:53
I can give me one sec. I can read you a little bit of the intro.
Margaret 14:01
Okay. When can we expect it? Do we know?
Felisha 14:03
Most likely June.
Margaret 14:07
Okay, summertime.
I really appreciate that your journey with your writing and your recovery appear to represent the thing we hear a lot in the rooms, which is like we’re onions and we’re peeling away the layers because it sounds like that’s what this evolution with your books has been?
Felisha 14:24
Yeah, they just kind of go deeper each one right.
Okay. So.
“It has taken me 29 years to understand that quitting is not at all what they teach you growing up. When I thought of quitting, I thought of losing, of not being good enough, too weak, too small, too dumb.
We are not meant to carry everything with us. As if my next achievement takes away that race, I couldn’t finish last year.
What a boring world it would be to be good at everything. And not only that, but there is also no possible way that we can collect all the accolades this world has to offer, yet we spend our lives trying.
We chase so many moments, or run down so many paths because the finish line could be something that gives us value. I’ve had so many chapters of my life that have brought me more peace, greater purpose, or completely saved my life, all by quitting.
Now, this didn’t mean quitting things out of fear or laziness. This means the power of letting things go that no longer fit my life. As I take you through my awakening of releasing chapters, people, and moments, I want you to take inventory of your own chapters.
Which ones are you holding on to? Which ones have closed? And do you have resentment about it?
It was a perspective shift for me when I started to view quitting as a skill. No different than choosing which gym you prefer. What vegetable you want to serve with dinner. You don’t panic in those situations and feel the need to cook every vegetable there is.
You choose one, pick a recipe and hope for the best. Or you choose a vegetable that you’ve cooked before and have all the ingredients to complete.
To follow this analogy. I want to express that there is no wrong vegetable to cook. But if I keep burning my brussel sprouts, why the f**** would I keep choosing them? Why do I want to make them so bad? Do I even like them? Once I started to question myself like this, about the choices in my life, I realized the intent behind my pursuits had nothing to do with my soul’s path. I don’t like brussel sprouts.
So, I don’t make them anymore.
Margaret 16:42
That’s the beginning. That’s so exciting. And it’s such a concept that will be so feeding of souls both on the addiction side and the family side. That full sense of control is very alluring,
Felisha: Yeah.
Margaret: I love brussel sprouts, I’ll eat your brussels sprouts.
Felisha 17:02
Yeah, like letting go of substances, I guess. Right? And what substances meant to me. Letting go of the concept of them.
I had to find a life that I loved more than substances. So, you can see how this was a chain. Right? I needed something that I wanted more than death. Found it. And I needed something that I liked more than drugs. And I have that today.
Margaret 17:28
And what is that?
Felisha 17:34
I have a lot of peace today.
Which was very uncomfortable for the first little bit in recovery, right? Being alone with yourself.
I have an identity. And the biggest piece of my recovery was recovering that. Who was I? Who am I? What do I actually want to do? I was in my master’s, and I have two degrees and all of this. What was I doing that for? Did I actually want that, or did I want something to give me meaning? That’s what I wanted to, so I dropped out of my masters. And now I can coach people in recovery. I’m writing, I left my agency job to start a business. And I’m doing it.
Margaret: And your business is called?
Felisha: Recover my Soul. And under that I have a podcast called Ouch That Hurt, which you will be on.
Margaret: I will.
Felisha: And then I have my books, coaching. And I hope to be doing workshops and things like that keynote speaking that kind of thing. So, kind of just building a network that feeds every part of me. And I don’t have to just creatively write in the dark. We’re no one’s going to see it right. I can be loud, and I can share my journey. And it’s never ending right. There will be another book after this one that tells you how to hold on to things or something, like that’s recovery. There’s no destination, just going to keep evolving.
Margaret 19:14
You are fearless and you are inspiring. And I appreciate so much that you not only share through your podcast, but you share in writing. You share in your coaching. I mean you have something to offer somebody no matter how it works for them, which is beautiful.
People can read in the privacy of their home; people can listen in the privacy of their home, people can get connected with you if they want to work with you.
How do you care for yourself today? When in the past we know from your story, what you did to numb, escape, care for. What’s different today.
Felisha 19:56
I think I’ve built a relationship with my emotions. And so, they’re kind of like visitors, I guess. And I can sit with every single emotion. I can sit with myself in a panic attack, and not need anybody else but me. I can hold my own hand today, and know that it’s temporary, and not make permanent reactions based on that one emotion. I don’t have pain today like I used to. So, the emotions aren’t as visceral, they just come and go, and I flow through them, giving back and helping others, using my voice.
I become sick or unwell when I’m not being authentic. When I’m putting myself in a box, or I’m performing or pretending to be something that I’m not. Putting myself into social situations I don’t want to be in. I was a partier, but that people automatically assume that means I’m social. I am actually better one on one. I like intimate settings with friends. And so, respecting that and setting boundaries, I have a lot of alone time. Moving my body, all of those things. But doing all of those things without expectation. So, I’m not moving my body to get a six pack. I’m moving my body so that I feel good mentally. I’m not meditating so I can, you know, manifest $1,000. Like, I’m not doing things with expectations. I’m doing things in the moment. And that has released me from a lot of pressure.
Margaret 21:56
Are you still active in recovery?
Felisha 21:59
I am not in 12 Step right now. I haven’t been for about a year. Because I was finding, I needed to heal my codependency. And 12 Step wasn’t helping that. So, I was like the DCM and I had the hotline here, I was the public rep, I had four positions. And I was, again overachieving. And I wanted an A+ in recovery. So, I needed to tone all of that down. I still have a sponsor today. And I have a really close group of women that we meet, in not a 12-step way, well kind of like we don’t do any other readings. But we sit around, and we each get that moment to blurt out whatever’s happening in our life. And I think one of the biggest things to keep me healthy is keeping people around me that 1,000% support my recovery. There’s not one person I could call and say, let’s get a drink. Not one. Not one person. And that keeps me safe.
Margaret 23:13
Did you go back and get the little girl that you left behind in prison?
Felisha 23:17
Yeah. Yeah. I was talking to somebody about this the other day that I’ve been having, not flashbacks. But I’ve been having these Deja vu moments of me when I was 19. And this drive has come back. This passion to help others and see the light. And that’s come back, and I feel home right now, with myself.
Margaret 23:48
And when you say you hold your own hand, made me think of her.
Felisha 23:51
MmHmm, yeah, that whole chapter feels so removed. Now. It would have been, I guess, five years in August since I was assaulted. So far removed. But yet such an important piece.
Margaret 24:09
Well and you’ve shared with me that you’ve done a lot of work therapeutically.
Felisha 24:13
Oh, yeah, I still do. I did really intensive therapy, just because of the intensity of my trauma to, it’s not something I want to share in a 12-step room. But instead of just using that as a cop out, like, I just won’t deal with it then. I found other ways to heal those pieces. So, I do really intensive therapy.
I literally had interviews for therapists. I needed the right one that I was going to go deep with. And we were going to do this long term and we’ve been working together for two and a half years now. And that’s been a really important piece.
Margaret 24:56
I respect that you interviewed them. I tell clients all the time. Do your research, ask the questions. You’re the consumer, and you have specific needs. They may have ideas of things to help you, but you need certain things. And to ask those questions. I think that’s very healthy that you found that person through doing that work.
Felisha 25:17
Mm hmm. I had a therapist who was so intrigued by my story, that he was invested in the storyline. And not so much what happened to me. And people can get lost in dangerous offenders and true crime and all of that, that they become then intrigued and I’m removed from what happened to me.
And so, it’s been very hard to find people to share that with in a safe way. But I’ve yeah, I’ve found my people. And I continue to because I’m doing this authentically, now. The right people are just kind of float like I met you, right? Like, those things wouldn’t have happened if I wasn’t in alignment with who I am today.
Margaret 26:10
I agree. I agree that my language our Higher Power puts people on our path at different times in different ways. And I thank you, I thank you for coming on and sharing. Your podcast is called ‘Ouch, That Hurt.’ And you’re the author of now three books. So exciting. I will make sure we have all of those links in the show notes so people can find you and can talk to you, and listen to you on your podcast.
Outro: I’m grateful to Felisha Hunter for being a guest who was willing to share her experience as an adult child of an alcoholic, a recovering addict, and a strong trauma survivor.
To learn more about Felisha and the great work she does in her coaching. To find her books, please see the show notes where I have included all information regarding Felisha Hunter for you to locate and find resources for yourself on this journey.
I want to thank my guest for their courage and vulnerability in sharing parts of their story. Please find resources on my website.
This is Margaret Swift Thompson.
Until next time, please take care of you!
