Today we complete the final episode with Glory, who has a mother who has the disease of addiction, and is a Social Worker.
In this episode Glory dives in to grief and losses associated with addiction. Her faith, and how fear can trigger self reliance verses reliance on her Higher Power.
The ongoing struggle to balance doing what she believes is healthiest for herself and her mother, while navigating the pressure of the perception that others see her as not a good daughter.
Shame, and how to stop ‘shoulding’ on herself, mixed with navigating the waves of hope and fear with relapse.
Glory shares a universal family struggle when you love someone with the disease of addiction:
“How do I love and let go”?
See full transcript of the episode below.
Intro: You’re listening to The Embrace Family Recovery Podcast. A place for real conversations with people who love someone with the disease of addiction. Now here is your host Margaret Swift Thompson
Margaret: Welcome back, we rejoin Glory the daughter of an addict who continues with her story. She begins with sharing about her grief associated with her mum’s addiction.
Glory: When your kid is struggling, and you don’t really know why it’s scary to put them in someone else’s hands because you don’t know also like what they’re going to figure out. Are you a terrible parent
like (laughter).
Margaret: You know let’s put it in black and white. Your mom’s addiction potentially puts you at risk from the simplest thing of using and then driving or not being conscious at different times and I’m not saying this was her story. This is just in general what the story could have looked like and as a result as a minor going to see a professional what if then CPS is involved, and I get my child removed from my home because of my addiction. I mean so the courage it took for your mom to encourage you to go to see a therapist is quite remarkable.
Glory: Yes, no I agree 100% and I’m incredibly grateful for that. I don’t think that, I mean there’s lots of parents I think that struggle with that I see a lot of the ones that I work with and I just always hope that people know whatever kind of discomfort there is there, that it’s worth it especially when it comes to your kids’ mental health.
Margaret: Really all that’s protected if we don’t get the help is the disease and the mental illness, not the people.
Glory: Right.
Margaret: That’s tragic right. ‘Cause they just grow if we don’t get the help. Mentioned the word gratitude. Have you got to a place in your life where you have felt gratitude to your mom’s disease?
Glory: I don’t know if I’ve ever really defined it as being grateful for her disease, but I definitely am grateful for the struggle. I don’t know maybe someday I’ll get to a place where I’m grateful for the disease. I still am at a point in my life where there’s so many things that I grieve that I’ve missed out on with my mom. It’s kind of, you know it’s an ongoing journey and I think that’s what’s so hard about recovery. There isn’t always a start and end it’s not a clear line from point A to point B. It’s this up and down and never really knowing if you’re going to you know, get what you always wanted from that person or get to that place where you just feel like, oh man that was so worth it because I do feel like the addiction has stolen some things from me that I still I will always grieve. But I am grateful for the struggle. ‘Cause I do feel like especially going through what I went through at that age it’s giving me so much more time to enjoy my life. Which may sound weird, but I feel like when you hit rock bottom so soon, and really get to the point where you didn’t think life is worth it anymore. To be able to come back up from that with so many more tools at such a young age I feel like I really have had the opportunity to enjoy a whole lot more in my life than probably the average person.
Margaret: It’s beautiful Glory that you have that perspective. Are you willing to share what you grieve or something you’ve grieved through this process?
Glory: Well. I think I definitely grieve who my mom could have been in those years. I grieve the relationship we could have had. Maybe the carefree attitude I potentially could have had as a kid. There’s lots of things that I still to this day kind of look back and say, oh I wish that was different but even now you know there’s parts of the relationship with my mom that I feel like I always grieve. In terms of what the drug has taken from my mom’s life and who she is today because of that. I will always grieve that ’cause I know who she is deep down inside, but it’s done a lot of damage, and there’s some things that can’t be undone. And I know she’s an incredible person and sometimes I just think oh well you know what if I could call her and we could do this thing together you know like mom and daughters do, and that’s just not something that’s in our cards and so I think that’s what I grieve. It is not only the things that we missed out on but even the things that I know probably will never happen that I had always hoped could have happened.
Margaret: I think it’s really important to use the word grief you know I think that there is legitimacy to that that nobody can understand if they haven’t experienced it. As you said the drug taking things from your relationship, from your experience, from her experience, from her health. And you know the damage that can be done that can be permanent and or the damage that can be reversed with recovery. And you don’t know which outcome we’re gonna have. Which is why the onus falls back on the family member getting help for themselves and you’ve done that. You know, you’ve done that and yes, your mom definitely despite all she was fighting in her own demons found the way to say go, you know go see someone it’s OK. Which is tremendous really.
Margaret: Glory shares about the road of addiction and recovery rarely being straight, rather bumpy and relapse happens. She wished she had known this at a younger age.
Glory: I think one other thing too we talked about the other day which I thought was kind of a cool gift that addiction has given us is, that during that time when my mom was inpatient, there were other people in my life that did have to step up and take care of me. And even after she came out and she had to go to meetings I told her this really cool memory that I have associated with her going to treatment is that I every Friday my mom would go to her AA meeting, and someone had to take care of me, and it was my godparents. My god parents had always been a big part of my life. But they played a different role during that time and
Margaret: Take your time, it’s okay this is real stuff.
Glory: I don’t think I would have gotten to know them as deeply if she wouldn’t have got to AA meetings. It’s almost as if it created an opening for me to be able to connect with other people who still today, they’re in their 90s. They are truly the most wonderful people in my life and again it’s because my mom needed help. And she asked for help. Which opens the door for another person to come in, for other people to come in and make an impact on my life. And so, I think that’s one thing, that’s one thing I really hope people learn is that sometimes when we say we can’t do something it actually opens the door for something better. And we don’t have to be and do all of the things all of the time. If we’re struggling and we need to take a break and take care of something, really cool things can happen when someone else steps up and fills that void. I will forever be grateful for that because again it’s just for now, you know for almost 30 years I’ve had these incredible people in my life in a very impactful way, that I don’t think would have happened without that journey.
Margaret: Who chose them to be your godparents?
Glory: I think my mom did.
Margaret: She did a good job.
Glory: She did. She did there are two of the most incredible people that I know, and you know they help without asking many questions. And were always there to support her regardless of what she went through, and it was just a great time for me to be able to, it was you know two hours maybe once a week, but it was exactly what I needed in that time of my life. To have people that were just there to take care of me to focus on what I needed and to pour into me and it made a huge impact.
Margaret: That’s beautiful and you were receptive to it. So, two things come to mind with that is we have biological family members, and we have people we bring into our life and allow to be family members. We also have a responsibility that sometimes is really scary to let people in. Like they can come knocking but if I’m not opening the door, I can’t receive what they can give me. You know you are very clear on your faith and identify God as your higher power. For me that journey’s been much more muddy. What I firmly believe is my higher power shows up in skin all the time and to me your godparents sound like one of those moments like there was your higher power your God in person there for you and showing you what you needed at that time. To feel valued and the other thing is I don’t think people realize the impact we imprint on each other’s lives. For example, their consistency that every Friday and then they’re out of being in your life gave you a sense of stability and value that you may not have been able to have while your mom’s illness was running rampant.
Glory: Right no, I think that’s definitely true and it to be honest with you it’s funny that you say you know God in human skin because actually my godfather used to be a priest and my godmother used to be a nun and they both left those professions because they felt God was calling them to something different. And without a doubt the impact that they made on my life and I know so many people’s lives just because they are accepting, and they never really ask questions. If someone needed help, they were just there to provide the help they really again just made a huge impact on my life. And where there is kind of you know caring party that didn’t really ask anything of my mom or me but were always there to receive this was incredibly helpful.
Margaret: It’s beautiful. Did you create that for your children?
Glory: I hope so yes. Honestly a part of that for me was getting them into counseling at a very young age. It was just another person, to me I always feel like the more people that can be involved in their life the better. Not only does it help them to realize that love and comfort and stability don’t just come from the parents, but it comes from lots of people and we are blended family. I’m technically their stepmom so they were already graced with two sets of parents, but I also have always tried to make sure that they have lots of other people involved in their lives. My husband and I talk about it all the time. Whether it’s through extracurricular activities, through the church I feel more people that they can have contact with and can tell them the strength they see in them, and the value that they can see in them is all the better. It just helps them to have a wider safety net that’s not just us, and it’s hard sometimes to ask for help when you need help, and you can’t perform as the parent in the way that you want to, but I do feel like that actually builds their trust in the world. That the world is going to step up even when their parents aren’t perfect and can’t do everything right. There’re still other things there that are going to catch them and make sure that they’re OK.
Margaret: And for a person who struggles with control that’s quite a gift to relinquish that.
Glory: And that’s only because I know that it’s worked. You know I’ve every time I trust every time. I trust what I get back is greater and so I just know inherently God put it on my heart you know that if I let go he’s always going to have someone there to catch me. That’s just, that’s just what he’s taught me and so I hope my kids have that. I hope my kids can know and trust that’s true and they remind me of it all the time. You know that I do need, I’m trying to hold the reins little too tight you know. I need to let go of control a little bit more. They’re 18 and 19 now so they’re able to give that insight now that they’re becoming adults. But I hope, I hope through all of this, through them seeing me struggle, through my own mental health journey and struggling with my relationship with my mom. I’ve been very open with them about that sometimes I’ve really struggled with it. I’ve struggled to try and protect them and to isolate them from their grandma because it just it was so scary for me. But I think we’re in a better place now and that’s only come from doing a lot of work and again trying to let go of that control and that in the end maybe they can learn from it all to you know there’s value in all of it.
Margaret: So, I’m curious along those lines you obviously have a profound faith and an equal portion of fear at least when it comes to mom and her illness. When I’m in fear I’ve let go faith not relying on my higher power and probably not letting other people in and I’m usually trying to control the world, that’s me. What are the triggers that you identify that destroy that connection with faith and take you straight to fear?
Glory: I think going back to it being my responsibility I think that’s the hardest thing for me especially because I always envisioned that at some point in time, I would be the caretaker of my mom. That was kind of the picture I always had in my head. And because her journey hasn’t looked the way that I had hoped it would look I definitely, whenever I go to the place where I say I should be doing something different that’s where I know it’s happening.
Margaret: OK so the should word.
Glory: Yep, I should be doing something different. Daughters need to be doing this for their moms. I’m a social worker I should be able to fix her. (laughter) All those things.
Margaret: There you go. Should is a big shaming word as we know.
Glory: (laughter) Yeah.
Margaret: Stop ‘shoulding’ on yourself, you have probably heard that before. I think that that’s really insightful because what is one of the most perplexing pieces of recovery as a family member, is I’m supposed to do what is completely counter intuitive
Glory: Exactly.
Margaret: to every ounce of my being, in order to help this person. Whereas if they had God forbid cancer you could do all those things you should be doing right, because it would help that person. But with this insidious disease it helps the disease, not the person if we do that and that’s such a big leap. So, what I hear happens is the fear comes up when that uncertainty and that instinctive intuitive responsive of wanting to be the nurturer the care provider but then thinking OK wait a minute what do I really need to do here.
Glory: Is this really going to help her?
Margaret: Do you ask yourself that? Do you question your motives? Like am I trying to help her in this, or will I help her in this, or will I help the disease in this? Like do you use that language does that help you figure it out?
Glory: For me it’s more of am I trying to make myself in the immediate moment feel better or am I going to do what’s the right thing to do for her for her recovery for my mental health and unfortunately some of the time it’s even as selfish as I don’t want it, I don’t want to be perceived as not being a good daughter to her. Which is hard to say, but sometimes that’s what it is. Sometimes I might be burnt out and feel like I couldn’t do anymore if I even wanted to, at this point but really then thinking about all my family members that are going to come to me and say, don’t you see what’s happening? Why aren’t you doing something? That is just 10 times worse and then I have that heaped upon it. And it can be a downward spiral for sure so making sure that I’m taking the temperature and saying am I trying to do this ’cause I just want to feel better right now, or am I doing this because in the long term it’s going to be best for her recovery and for my own mental health.
Margaret: Interesting, can observe that the first thing after you shared what’s best for is her recovery then your mental health. And I only share that with the grace and love that I relate to it. That no matter how hard I work my program, one of my most beloved people in my life has a struggle, (snap fingers) and it’s that instinct that I go to them first. Me second and reversing that is probably the hardest part of the job of recovery. ‘Cause it feels selfish even though it is absolutely not, because then I’m better for the person I love so much if I do put me first in my recovery.
Glory: And I think do there’s a part of it as well, and I don’t know if this is because we have a mother daughter relationship. But I definitely have gone through seasons where I’ve been very enmeshed with my mom, and I think so much of it is, her recovery is my mental health and so it’s been difficult to peel those pieces apart. Because so much of our world says that’s healthy, that’s great you know you should have a good relationship with your parents, and you should be close to them and all of that is good. That was hard for me. That was something that I dealt with probably in my early 20s was when I first got married trying to kind of peel away a little bit from her, from her recovery. Just from our lives in general, and I think that’s part of the reason why for me those are two almost equal things right, like I say her recovery in my mental health because it is, they are so intertwined for me and I work on it obviously, but it is, it’s a struggle for sure.
Margaret: I work on it too, but it can disappear as fast as, like sometimes I don’t even realize I’m doing it until someone reflects it back to me, and I’m like Oh yeah that’s not helping me right now and, is certainly not helping them. Because I’m actually doing more for them than I need to be doing. But because it feels good to me right now, it gives me that little high that I like when I’m the one in charge and, it’s going my way that’s not necessarily going to help them in the long run.
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Margaret: So, a good friend of mine in my career said one of the gifts I will give you is teaching you to wear Teflon in certain situations. So that when the words come at you, they slide right on down to the floor. And I share that only because I think when other people have opinions. Right or wrong, good or bad, well intentioned or not. I have to learn to let go of that as much as possible or it will derail my sanity and my sense of wellbeing instead.
Glory: That’s definitely good advice. I tell my kids that they should be like glass. (laughter)
Margaret: OK.
Glory: Just let it slide right off.
Margaret: Yeah, so I will literally if I’m going into battle if I’m going into a situation, I know that is with people that tend to trigger me. I like literally don the Teflon mentally before I walk in the room and work really hard to not take it. They get to have their say. What I do with it as my job, and that’s not easy to do with our families. That’s where the biggest trigger points are, I think for most of us to react.
Glory: Well and I think huge part of that too is because that’s where the foundation of who we are comes from.
Margaret: Right.
Glory: That’s you know, our all of our early years of figuring out who we are is by who our family says we are. And I think it’s it takes a lot of work to figure out who you actually want to be and believe for yourself who you are regardless of what your actions may say to other people.
Margaret: Yeah, so is there any aspect of your story that you haven’t touched on that you would want to share that could be helpful to someone out there listening?
Glory: I think one thing is just that you know, the path isn’t straight, and I feel like if someone would have told me that sooner, I don’t know if it would have made a difference. But that’s the hardest part to deal with. I feel like so many times you know when you think of other diseases. Not always, but often it’s it goes from one direction and just keeps going and maybe you know, say it’s someone with a terminal disease and they just deteriorate and deteriorate and then eventually they’re gone. With addiction it’s so different because sometimes you’ll get these moments where you think that it’s gone, and everything is OK, and for that moment you put your guard down and then you get caught off guard when it happens again. And so I think that’s been the most challenging part of this. Is even when I talk about grief, I sometimes feel like I start to grieve something and then I see a hint of it coming and I get so excited that maybe this is done. Maybe it’s over with and then before I know it, it’s we’re back at point one again and it’s really, really difficult to grieve something that almost keeps coming back. And you don’t know, it’s hard to stick on that course and finish your grief when it keeps being resurrected and I think it’s something that I would hope people realize is that it’s hard, it’s hard because it doesn’t follow that straight line. And for many people you know relapse is a part of recovery. It may happen many times during their journey and that is, that is what makes it difficult but if we know that that is a part of the process and, we can accept it is a part of a process I think that’s where we can find some freedom. It’s knowing that we are going to have ups and downs it’s not going to just one day, you know be completely over. and then in some way we can figure out how can we ride this well, and that’s the part where I’m at now.
Margaret: Well, that’s the gift of, in my humble opinion, Al-Anon the gift of a 12 step program for family members. To learn how to ride the wave without getting sucked under. I do think it is natural to go to the hope when you see the glimmer of it. Who doesn’t want something different for the person they love. It’s just such insidious process of trying to separate ourself and our wellbeing from their wellbeing. And I think you’re right. I think to know that relapse happens. That it is a symptom of addiction, that’s what I like to call it, and so symptoms happen. But don’t have to happen. The other piece is that family members relapse, and that’s very rarely talked about. But my relapse happens when I hit anger or fear, and I will go back to control, fix, manage (finger snap) in a second. And have to like, catch myself and that doesn’t always happen. I might end up down that rabbit hole before someone else says, hey you doing OK? ‘Cause I let people in. And I think the other thing is having people who understand your journey come alongside you ’cause they’ve walked it, can be a real gift to understanding what to do to take care of yourself through the rollercoaster of potential relapse of someone you love.
Glory: Definitely. You know I think that’s true and I think for me, a lot of times that has been a therapist or counselor in my life that’s walked alongside me, and it’s only now that I’m starting to learn about Al-Anon and the support that comes in the group which I think has been incredible. But to be honest as my mom and I were talking about this the other day and she said you know I wish I would have done that for you sooner I wish I would have tried to get you involved in that. A part of me is almost grateful that didn’t happen because I so feel that it really became my own journey. I never associated my struggles with my mom being an addict. It was I was struggling, and I feel like it almost gave me a head start. So even though I am, I feel like my journey has been kind of backwards in terms of only now coming to know about Al-Anon and the support that’s there. I am grateful that I’ve always known that it starts with me first. I have to make sure that I’m taking care of my own mental health in order to really be who I need to be as a daughter of someone who’s in recovery.
Margaret: Right and I think that you emulate that in the times we’ve spoken and shared you found your way through therapists and your spirituality, and your mental health. And now it’s maybe another added piece to the story of giving yourself another resource.
Glory: Oh yes, and it’s been it’s been incredible, and I think too it’s good. I feel like you know, I’m not old by any means but I think to try new things at this age is really good. I think it’s important not only for me to be able to experience new things and a new type of vulnerability. But it’s so good to do this when my kids are at their age too because they’re able to see me doing something that feels uncomfortable and being vulnerable with people that I don’t know and being able to grow through that. I feel like if we can give that to our kids that they know the value that comes from me vulnerable and accessing those services that are available for people. I mean that’s the best gift we could give them you know.
Margaret: Agreed and you are emulating that and have been through your life whether it be through a therapist or letting people in, in your church, in your community but also now looking at Al-Anon and I do think, great quote from one of my wise sponsors along the road was ‘when you’re green you’re growing, when you’re ripe you’re rotting’. I don’t want to ever be ripe and that’s how you feel to me. You’re willing to push and grow and learn and go inward and that’s truly. There are a lot of people that go through this life that never go inward, they just keep looking outward. And even in the helping profession, get into the helping profession but don’t do their own work. Which you have done I think that a lot of people get into it because they’ve been through things and some get into it and don’t do their own work to heal and use the job to help heal them, and I don’t believe that will work in the long run.
Glory: Well and I think sometimes we like to think maybe that we’ve conquered things.
Margaret: You have!
Glory: And that we have no need help anymore but there’s always something new to conquer. There’s always somewhere where we need extra healing or where we can do extra work on ourselves. And just be happier, more whole people that can show up better for others. And I think that’s the one thing that always has blessed me is to be able to see when I do work on myself it always blesses the people around me. Even if it feels uncomfortable for me, I’m able to show up better for my kids, for my husband, for my church, for my employees, for everyone that I’m around. I’m able to show up better when I’m doing those uncomfortable things.
Margaret: Agreed, agreed. Well, I am so grateful that you spent this time with me, and I thank you. It’s never easy to put yourself out there in any platform. Glory, but to be willing to share your story. And you know everybody’s story is unique and different, but there’s always some sort of overlap somewhere and someone out there will identify with this. And I think you’re tremendous in that you found help young and was willing to embrace it and tackle it. ‘Cause there’s a lot of us who struggled to do that even as older people in. So, some inspiration to know that you did do that hard work at a young age and continue to do it still. Really amazing, and to your mom, you honor her. You honor her in every way by doing your own work because you show your love for yourself first, but also for her and telling that disease in the same time that it’s not going to destroy you. Which is pretty powerful. I would think she’s a very proud woman to see what her daughter has done with her life.
Glory: I hope so.
Margaret: She had something to say in that I think.
Glory: (laughter)
Margaret: I hope you’ve enjoyed hearing from Glory as much as I have. And if you missed any of the episodes please go back and review them. Her story is quite remarkable and full of resilience and great information, especially for any parents out there who want to understand more about what their children or child may be going through. I wish Glory and her mum continued wellness in the search for peace in recovery.
Please come back next week when I have a special surprise, our next guest will be an author, and I know you won’t want to miss it. Until next time please take care of you.
I want to thank my guest for their courage and vulnerability in sharing parts of their story. Please find resources on my website embracefamilyrecovery.com
This is Margaret Swift Thompson, until next time please take care of you.
