Today I have such an exciting guest for you to meet …
Sandy Swenson.
As a professional in the field of addiction and serving family members, I have recommended Sandy Swenson’s books to many people.
Every week in the Family Program at Hazelden Betty Ford, I read from ‘Tending Dandelions’, Sandy Swenson’s meditation book for mothers of addicts.
Sandy shares her story in this episode, also shares on her journey out of denial and what tough love means to her.
Sandy has started a movement for “Mama’s” where she has dedicated herself to educating, enveloping and empowering moms with addicted children. Learn more on her website
https://www.sandyswenson.com/dandelion-strong-blog-for-moms-with-addicted-children/
Every Monday at 8:30 am Central Time Sandy offers a live event on her FaceBook Page – Sandy Swenson.
Dandelion Mamas from across the globe share a burst of positivity and strength for 10 minutes. Together we are living with heartache and wishes. And together we are stronger.
See full transcript of the episode below
Intro: You’re listen to the Embrace Family Recovery Podcast. A place for real conversations for people who love someone with the disease of addiction. Now Here is your host Margaret Swift Thompson.
Margaret: Welcome back. Today is an exciting day as I start a series of conversations with Sandy Swenson who is an author, and a woman I admire for being willing to share her story in her first book, the Joey Song. Which speaks of her journey with her son’s addiction, and also my favorite meditation book for moms Tending Dandelions. She’s also recently written Just Dandy. I am thrilled to be able to introduce you to Sandy Swenson so, let’s hear from her.
You’re listening the Embrace Family Recovery Podcast
Margaret: Let’s wet our whistle. Moisturize, as that gets ready to talk.
Sandy: Yes, right yes.
Margaret: So, I have absolutely been giddy Sandy about having you on with me. We did a webinar and I was trying to reflect how long ago that was I think three years ago.
Sandy: At least three, possibly four.
Margaret: Yeah, we did a webinar for Hazelden Betty Ford where I got to speak with you and to you in that webinar and I had been recommending your book Tending Dandelions to so many moms even before meeting you because I think it is such a powerful piece of literature and knowledge and experience that helps so many. And I know we’re going to talk about that, but welcome Sandy! I’m glad to have you with me and
Sandy: Thank you so glad to join you.
Margaret: Really excited to hear your story. I’ve read your books, but I want our audience who may not have, to know you’re out there and what you’ve written in your wonderful word. So when I start this with almost every guest I ask who your qualifier is? So how did you find yourself in the position you’re in of a mom who wrote these books?
Sandy: My oldest son struggles with addiction. So, it started first book was published in 2014, but I started writing the book in 2008 so that’s, and we’d already been in this for a while so and it still goes on today.
Margaret: So, you have how many children?
Sandy: I have two boys, my oldest son Joey and my younger one Nick.
Margaret: And your older son Joey is the one who has the disease of addiction. And tell us a little bit about what the journey was like for you with his disease. When did you start being aware of it being a problem?
Sandy: Well, when we started noticing we had had a problem we were living in India overseas for two years for his junior and senior year of high school. We had moved a lot and so this was just another move and another international move. But now he was a junior in high school and that was the first time in our life that we noticed that we had a problem with him, but we thought it was just growing up teenage troubles. And it took us a lot of water under this big old roaring river bridge to come to the realization that it was an addiction problem, and that did not happen until we sent him off to his first year of college. We moved back to the United States to be sure. To be close because you know we were having issues. And um he was arrested before he even got there, and it was just a downward spiral. He tried to kill him himself. He went out back to college to get in, before the 1st week of college he was back home and moved in with us for a bit. And that’s when we realized this was a drug or alcohol issue and even at that it took years to understand the scope of this thing. Even with the arrests and overdoses and everything, we lived in so much denial and I was the queen of the queen of thinking I could fix this for my son. That was the whole deal for years was me gonna fix this for him.
Margaret: Hmm
Sandy: Didn’t work.
Margaret: No that’s one of the most difficult things of this journey to understand as family members. Correct.
It’s, I love them fiercely I know them so well and yet we’re all blindsided by the disease. We’re all manipulated by the disease. I’m coming to the understanding that what you are doing is not helping your son but fueling the disease. When did you have that revelation? When did it hit you, that you recognize that’s not my job anymore?
Sandy: Well first of all you know we were trying to, um the disease was manipulating us and we were trying to out manipulate the disease. I mean it was a thing. And for a long time, I felt like I was doing battle with my son because that’s what you know, it’s what it felt like. Because I’m in his face and he’s in my face and we’re yelling and screaming at each other. And you know, he’s yelling horrible words and I’m, you know stalking him and stuff. I felt like I was doing battle with my son.
And at some point, I want to say, maybe four or five years into this, it finally struck me that I was not doing battle with my son. Maybe my son’s face I am seeing but the addiction, the addict inside is the one I’m doing battle with. And that’s when I was able to separate my behaviors.
I was trying to help my child but in reality, I was helping the addict.
And when it came to figure this out then it was OK, now I’ve got this. I don’t want to please the addict. I want my son to someday look back at this and say my mom was working for me. And not being intimidated and manipulated by the addict, because the addict and the child have different needs and desires. And my loyalty is going to be to my son and sometimes my, the addict who resides in my son, hates my guts.
And it hurts. I can’t lie it hurts but I don’t care because I love my son more than the addict. So, I’m gonna do the toughest love of all which does not mean what people think. Tough love, which is to be mean and walk away. No. I think tough love means tough love because it is the toughest love of all. To do the right thing for our child even though it’s breaking our hearts. Whatever that might be. Whatever that looks like and it should never be angry or mad or anything, you know it’s done with love, just love.
At the end of the day, I’m in this now a long time 15/20 years, something like that now, and all I have at this point with my son is love, just love. And when I say it like that just love it’s like well just that’s the only thing left but really that is huge. That is the most important thing that we have and my son knows that he’s loved and it’s something to hang out there so that there is something healthy and whole for him to return to when and if he’s ready and that’s not just a just that’s huge, that’s huge!
Ad: This week Tuesday April 13th myself, Kirkland Hamill the author of Filthy Beasts, and Gordon Johnson will be hosting a three part series for a small group of people who choose to register to participate in this Book Club Session. Where we will look at parts of the story and dive into our own stories, in a way to build our community of support with other family members who love someone with the disease of addiction. If you’re interested ,please register at Gordon@nullcircle.bm
Please register soon as spaces are limited because we want it to be a more intimate sharing experience.
Bumper: This podcast is made possible by listeners like you. Can you relate to what you’re hearing never miss a show by hitting the subscribe button. Now back to the show.
Margaret: You’re prioritizing your wellbeing gives your son the best of who you could possibly be for him when he does surface and want to do something different.
Sandy: Ah absolutely. I mean I’m not a yelly person I really just, it’s just not my nature. But early on in this oh, I was yelling, screaming. I mean I was just, I just became a different person and then of course that gave him something to fight against, and yell back at more, and swear at me and you know call me horrible things.
And it was just this thing until I stopped engaging in that. And then as I stepped back, he was no longer pushing against me. Because I was the one he was pushing against instead of, it was no way he was ever going to fight his disease with me in middle. I’m the one that he put all of his efforts, and angers, and energy at was me, and so as I stepped back. then he had to fight other things, but not me. It wasn’t mine to be in the middle of anyway.
But also, then we had a chance now, for the last several years and it’s been rocky I gotta tell you, it’s not all been you know flowers and roses, but we had a chance to heal from all those ugly words. I hardly even remember them now, well not really ’cause I really do remember them, but their way back there. There’s something healthy for him to return to that as huge because we were killing our relationship, that used to be so good. We were killing it with just vileness. And now that is behind us. We haven’t had vile words for I don’t even know how many years. Years and years and years. We haven’t had vile words. We have a lot of I love you’s and there’s something healthy here. Me, me but also then our family because if mom ain’t happy, ain’t nobody happy. You know that whole thing, it all gets a mess. By keeping myself where I belong and working on me, which is the thing I can work on. There’s something healthy. Imagine if he came back and I was still that bitter, angry, blamey whatever I was. Why would he want to come back to that, you know?
Margaret: You said it hasn’t been easy.
Sandy: No.
Margaret: Has he found recovery at all in this journey?
Sandy: No.
Margaret: And so, one could assume that would mean a lot of ups and downs of doing really OK somewhat and then doing really badly, possible overdoses, consequences along the journey?
Sandy: Um yes. But actually, we live quite far away from each other. He lives in Florida and I live in Minnesota, so I’m very removed from that. That didn’t stop me before because I would stalk his email and his Facebook. I had old passwords I mean I had my ways, mothers can be very detective, you know, professionals. So, I don’t ask about that stuff anymore.
So, when I am speaking about you know in the last 10 years, it’s my recovery. Because I don’t focus on where he is, other than that, we talk. We share a lot of I love you’s, and I don’t ask or if I get snippets of things that don’t make sense, or they terrify me ’cause he drops a little something. I basically ignore it because I can’t do anything about it. I don’t know if it’s true because many things that are said aren’t. I can’t worry about this thing I can do nothing about. Which then saps me of all of my energies. My one place I can put my energy into his loving him and that’s where I’m putting my love, and that is not just our phone calls and texts.
But it’s also the work I do the books I write, the connecting with the moms because I’m a big believer in scattering the love sideways. You know I may not be able to hands-on fix him because I can’t, because of course we can’t do that with any grown adult period, ever. However, what I can do is spread goodness and understanding that addiction is a disease not a disgrace. And try to change the way people perceive addiction, including my son. So, he doesn’t have to feel shame and then in time, and people, and spreading, and eventually it reaches him from some other angle, and some other person. And they’re going to be able to help him in a way I can’t. To me. That is where to put the energies. I feel that’s way more constructive than in his face yelling at him. (laughter)
Margaret: Or not taking care of yourself at all. And jumping on a plane every five minutes or keeping your focus on him. Doing all this mental gymnastics, of trying to figure out where he’s at versus actually focusing on where am I at right now. How my doing?
Sandy: Oh, absolutely and, and then the kicker of that of course is when you get to the place of understanding this is that the first scenario doesn’t do any good for anybody. Not him, not me, nothing, nothing. It’s basically banging your head on the wall trying to feel better but really not. The second scenario actually has the potential to do a lot a lot of good in so many ways.
Margaret: I agree, couldn’t agree more. When you do hear the nuggets that get dropped that are difficult, and you don’t know if they’re true and to your point, you don’t ask. You don’t react. What do you do with the energy that comes up in you at that time you get off the phone? What do you do to take care of yourself? Cause that’s a real everyday scenario for anybody who loves someone with the disease.
Sandy: Well, it depends. Sometimes, as long this has been going on and as, you know exactly I know what I should do and how to react. I don’t always do, you know it’s not a perfectly. You know, you get it down once and you got it forever, it’s just not that way. So sometimes after we hang up, I have a good cry. I call a friend and say “oh my gosh you know he said this”, I don’t wanna believe this because it’s so horrible and it may not be true at all. Because that’s happened before to where the some horrible thing, and it was not even remotely true. So, I don’t wanna get too invested in something that might not be true but on the other hand if it is true, oh my gosh you know.
It’s not perfect, you know but I do consciously know what to do you know to talk to friends, to cry, to feel the feels. Gotta feel the feels you know and then focus my energies into my mom stuff, into the books and helping the moms and spreading what I can in a good way and hoping it’ll land on his head one day in the very good, you know, loving person helping him in some other way. So, re directing.
Thanks for being with me today. And I hope you’ve enjoyed getting to know Sandy Swenson. She’ll be back again next week to go further into parts of her story and share from her books. In the meantime, find out more about Sandy on her website sandyswenson.com, a place where love and addiction meet.
I want to thank my guest for their courage and vulnerability in sharing parts of their story. Please find resources on my website embracefamilyrecovery.com
This is Margaret Swift Thompson until next time please take care of you.
